Thryv is Playing Chess, Not Checkers: Turning Marketing into Revenue

What's up, everybody? We are here and we're live. And I am super, super excited to have Tammy Conasaro and Daniel Huddleston from one of the amazing Domo customers, Thryv. Tammy is the CMO, Daniel is the senior manager of analytics and business insights. Tammy and Daniel, welcome. Thank you, Marc. Thank you. Great to be here. We are so excited to talk about this story. Um, I'm the CMO at Domo. Uh, Tammy is a, a much, a much better CMO than I am at Thryv, and I am just excited to learn from her. You'll see that w- what, what we're gonna do today is dig in deep to what Tammy's doing from a CMO perspective with Domo. What Daniel is doing to answer any and every question, and I know they are many if Tammy's anything like, anything like I am. Um, we're gonna have some really kind of organic raw conversations, so I'm excited. Before we do that though, Tammy, give us, give us the overview. For those who are on, who is Thryv? Oh, well, thanks. Well, Thryv serves SMB customers, and we've been at it for, believe it or not, over 100 years. Uh, transitioning from, you know, the early days of the Yellow Pages into digital online marketing services. And, uh, we, we now work with customers. We have a platform and services to really help small businesses to, to grow. That's awesome. That's fantastic. So when we kicked off this webinar, everyone, you'll, you'll know, and I think you've seen, the title of the webinar is, "Thryv is playing chess, not checkers: Turning marketing into revenue." My biggest pet peeve, number one biggest pet peeve as a CMO is too often people get stuck... Tammy, you've seen the same thing, I'm sure. On, "I gave the lead to the sales team. Like, I brought it in top of funnel." (laughs) And then they didn't close it. Well, our job is revenue focused. If it doesn't get to a closed deal, we haven't done our job. So, Tammy, am I off on that? Did... Am I thinking about it incorrectly? Not, not at all. In, in fact, you know, I, I usually only talk about, you know, closed won deals brought, brought by marketing. I never, I never... You'll never hear me talk about MQLs other than to my marketing team outside of the marketing team, right? 'Cause no one really gets excited about an MQL. It's, it's, uh, it's revenue and business, right? Yeah. I can promise you that Tammy and I sit in boardrooms, and the board is never asking us, "So is your MQL volume up by 73%?" They don't care. What they care about is, are we hitting the ACV targets? MQLs, SALS, QOAs, pipeline are only as good if they get you to closed won deals. That's it. And so when we thought about what we should... what we should talk about here, you know, that idea of chess is a long-term strategic approach. That's why we framed today's conversation around that idea. So as we start things off, Tammy, how do you think about marketing strategy in that spirit of long-term strategic approach focused on ACV and revenue? Not focused on, well, I got it into the tip top of the funnel and then it's sales job. Well, we look at... You know, there's a, there's a limited amount. There's a finite amount of resources, right? And so I look at what are the, what are the revenue driving channels? And at Thryv, we have direct. We have about a 500 person sales force that's direct. We have a channel where we're, we're, you know, driving revenue through partners, and then we have digital inbound where we're driving, you know, demos and, and trials through the website. And so my job is to really look across those three channels and, and constantly optimize those channels. And then also make trade-offs in terms of the investment and looking at the ROI and, you know, the, the cost of, of driving those deals across each channel. And just, you know, every day trying to get a little bit better and make sure that I'm optimizing correctly, uh, you know, and making the right trade-offs. I love that. I love that. So Thryv has been through a really, really intriguing transformation. You've gone from, you know, 100 plus, 125-year-old marketing services company to a modern SaaS platform that now I think represents roughly half or more than half of your revenue, right? This year, yeah. We crossed the chasm. (laughs) Amazing. So when we look at inflection points, what was the biggest inflection point for your marketing team in that transition? Oh, that's a great, that's a great question. The biggest transition for the marketing team... I mean, I think when I joined, I, I was actually brought on to drive digital, digital inbound. And so, you know, that was a, a, you know, a piece of work making sure we have the right systems, the right story, you know, the right experience across the web and driving the... you know, driving those deals. But, you know, I think, I think a bigger transition was, you know, really, really aligning across the three channels and understanding that marketing's job isn't just digital inbound, but marketing's job is really to support revenue and really think through the go-to-market model. And, and so we've been experimenting with a lot of different go-to-market strategies, whether it's, you know, you know, taking inbound and landing a smaller inbound deal and then having sales upsell or, you know, bringing in and working on partnerships between sales and, and partners and, and trying to do, you know, co-events and co-locate. So it's, it's a, it's a fairly complex strategy. Um, and, you know, when I came in and saw that I was really brought in to drive digital inbound, but, you know, looking at our field of 500 sellers, you know, I quickly realized, I think we have a little bit of a secret sauce in our, in our field. And so we set up a model similar to... kind of similar to the real estate or the insurance model where we have your, you know, your local Thryv rep. And so we've really kind of worked to build up the local presence of those reps, even building up local websites where they can be found online. So if you Google, you know, "Find a Thryv rep near me," your, your rep comes up. And, and so that was a pretty big... I think, a pretty big transformation, uh, in terms of what the expectations were for marketing.That's awesome. So, Tammy, when we look at chess specifically, it's about anticipating what's next, it's about looking into the future. When you think of when you came on originally to run Digital Inbound, what's one early decision that you made in that SaaS journey that's helping you to drive momentum today? Well, I, I think a big one is product positioning. When I joined Thrive, the, the product was, it... we were calling it a client experience platform, and then we moved to all-in-one software, and then we've now... we're, we're now a growth platform. And I, I think the growth platform truly pays off in a better way. And so, you know, I think it really helps us to, uh, you know, to, to, to sell in, in a unique value prop, which has been wonderful. We've also upgraded the systems, including, including Domo and our analytics platform. When I first joined, we, um, you know, we weren't on best-of-breed systems, and so we've moved to best-of-breed systems. And we had to... you know, when you're looking across three channels, right, and then across those channels various investments, it becomes very complex. The decisions are very complex. And so the team was kind of pulling together spreadsheets and, uh, I can't imagine that... the manual pulls that, that Daniel was doing to try to give us the data to make the decisions. And so as we moved online to Domo, it really helped us to be able to make much more intelligent decisions about our, you know, our go-to-market strategy and the investments we were making. Ca- case in point, Tammy was telling me right before this, they've got, they've got their inaugural big show coming up. You ought to put a plug in, Tammy, while we have so many people. And, and prior to this, like, this is your first show, but you would have had a spreadsheet that Daniel probably updated every however, however often, and now, you go in and look at it and see real time what your data's looking like, right? Exactly, exactly. It really does, you know, give you abilit- the ability to look on a daily basis, uh, you know, whether you're moving the needle, what's working, what's not working, and, and where I need to focus on. Love that. So poll question number one for those in the audience, we have a, a, a big chunk of people who are here, what is the biggest marketing challenge that you are facing right now? Uh, I wanna see, I wanna see responses, I wanna see what you are thinking. Uh, for me, I'll be honest, and Tammy, I'm gonna ask you, number one for me, uh, go to the polls tab, uh, everyone, and you can, you could see that. But if you s- for me, the number one thing we're struggling and trying to figure out is how do I most efficiently use AI and enable my team to use AI to be able to be more efficient? For us, we've put in place, and Tammy and I spoke about this, an individual on our marketing team and on our development team whose entire job is AI. How do I help our development team be more effective using AI? How do I use our... uh, you know, how does our marketing team use it from a content, from a performance, from an inbound, from a anything and everything perspective to be more efficient? Tammy, what about you? Well, I, I, I really love to be able to use AI in order to, to drive those channel optimiz- optimization recommendations, which I, I think is kind of where it's moving to. We use it today to, to kind of build ads and to, you know, um, sometimes give us, you know, starter, uh, starter messaging on those ads and, and look at the competition. There's so many different uses of AI, but a really exciting use case is being able to take your investment and look across those investments and ask AI to recommend da- recommend an optimization strategy. I love that. I love that. Okay, Tammy, um, you have used... you've used automated reporting and eliminated spreadsheets essentially with Domo. From your perspective, how did that shift free your team to be able to focus on more higher value work? Yeah, it real- it really does free the team, and I have a, I have a weekly war room that we call where we look at all the numbers and all the data, and the team used to spend hours, if not days, preparing for that meeting. And now rather than working on, you know, you can see the shift. Rather than working on preparing the slides and what the slides look like, you know, it's talking about the data and we're real- I think ever- able to have a better conversation and really spend our time looking at what the data is telling us and, you know, what we need to do in terms of ch- you know, trade-offs, uh, in our spend as opposed to spending so much time preparing the data. Yeah, so Tammy, it's so intriguing because for me, what AI and in this case even some automation work you're doing with Domo does is it takes you or Daniel from focused on the menial tasks to the meaningful ones that will actually drive ROI in the business. Like yes, Daniel, you could spend all day long going through and pulling reports or we can automate it so that Tammy just has access to anything and everything that she needs at any point. T- and Daniel, we're gonna call on you, so I apologize. Yeah. (laughs) Like, which would you rather as an analyst? Well, no, I mean, th- you, you spoke truth, right? I mean, and, and Tammy didn't lie, like... (laughs) previously, I would literally spend the first week of every month, like just digesting all of the reports and, you know, populating the manual stuff. And it's like, that was five days, like solid five days that you don't get back, didn't really add value, right? 'Cause it's more about the conversations you have about the data, not... we'll call it the preparation piece, right? You've gotta do the preparation, but it's really the insights you wanna talk about. And, you know, before there was a lot of wasted energy. Yeah, so o- one of the, one of the statements that we sometimes leverage over here at Domo is data is hard, Domo is easy. Um- Yeah. ... the more you're stuck in those menial tasks of pulling data and making sure it looks the exact way and making sure it's automated in the right way, that doesn't help Tammy do her job.It doesn't. Yeah, no. What helps her is she needs the information that she needs at any given point to be able to make decisions that will strategically drive the business. And so, being able to move, Daniel, from these menial tasks, to the meaningful ones that actually help Tammy run the business is, is a pretty massive shift. So, congrats. Tammy, anything you wanna add there? Yeah. It also helps you to be able to hire a higher level of talent, right? If you're gonna hire someone who's literally spending their day pulling together different data sources and, you know, spending the g- better part of their week stringing together data, versus, you know, they've got the right tools and they're actually able to be, become more of an analyst, right, and an advisor. It also, I think, changes the role of the practitioners. I love that. Totally agree. Okay. So, at this point, now we're at a point where you can connect those marketing investments to sales results, so you can actually show real-time ROI, or what kind of impact you're making. How did that change your marketing practice? Well, I, I, I would say we're able to more quickly pivot. So, you know, rather than (laughs) literally rather than waiting a week or, you know, wait till all the data's thrown together, right, you're daily looking at the data and kind of understanding and able to make trade-offs. So, it's the little things, right? Like, you know, it's a h- it's a holiday on Monday, it's Labor Day, and so, you know, being able to quickly see, like, "Okay, you know, what, what happened last Labor Day? Did people buy more? Did they buy less? You know, should we push in more MQLs, less MQLs?" You're, you're really able to sort of, I think, make some more dynamic and more granular decisions, whereas before, you, you wouldn't have had that data at your fingertips to be, you know, to be so s- precise. And, and Tammy, to your point, and I'm in the same place, it's like, we have over-focused sometimes, as marketers, on that MQL, or on the SAL, or whatever, and at the end of the day, that is not the prize. The prize is, are we bringing in new logo customers? Are re- are we retaining customers? Do we have happy customers who are driving real business outcomes with your platform? Because if it, all it is, is, "Yeah, well, we got the MQLs again," it's the conversation we had earlier. "Okay, well, we've got really great top of funnel." Yeah, but none of it converts. You can now have the important conversations that say, "Yeah, but those MQLs, I could get you millions of MQLs today." That's not hard, as you know. Exactly. It's the close- it's the, are my reps able to actually close it? Am I nurturing them in the right way? So, so intriguing. So intriguing. Daniel, so you have led the work to make this, this vision a reality. Let's talk about the challenges. What were some of the challenges in consolidating all that data into one view? And if you can give us a, a bit of a look into, what did that look like? You were using spreadsheets before. Like, wha- what was that consolidation like? Yeah. Yeah, I mean, you know, again, I think within any company, uh, and especially, you know, as your company scales, very quickly, you get, like, the data silos and, like, the pockets. And, like, this team knows their data really well, but how does it really connect to the next step down the journey? And so, you know, when, I would say we kinda started out, uh, you know, down this path, I was always, I'm gonna call it, like, team agnostic, but like, customer-centric, right? Like, I wanted to follow their journey from, like, the point they show up, when, you know, Tammy gave 'em an ad, all the way through the point that they fill out that cancel survey, right? So you were kinda talking about, like, you know, the MQLs and, like, how do you do and did it convert? But, but we go beyond conversion, right? We go into, like, their onboarding journey and how they're using the platform and, you know, what support tickets they're opening, so that we can go, like, "Wait a minute, there's something bubbling up here in cancel reasons. Like, let's go back to when they originally purchased. Like, what's driving that?" And, you know, theoretically, if you can connect that to your TikTok ad and their cancel reason, then all of a sudden now you're like, "Wait a minute, like, I can have a different type of conversation." Um, and so, that's kind of been our journey, is to, like you said, stitch those pieces, uh, together, um, you know, supporting Tammy's team, but, you know, we also support our sales team and our product team and our customer support team. And I think that holistic view on our data, um, has really kind of unlocked new insights and just, you know, changed the dialogue of the discussion around how we can use data at Thrv to help, help us, you know, improve the customer experience that we're delivering. Daniel, we're not live or anything, so don't worry, but if you were- Okay. (laughs) ... choosing between who's more favorite, your marketing leader or your sales leader, we know who you'd choose, right? (laughs) Obviously, obviously. Yes. (laughs) Okay. Very politically correct way to answer that question. (laughs) (laughs) So, walk us through, Daniel, what did it look like before, and how has automation changed the day-to-day of your team? Yeah. I mean, you know, again, kinda like we were saying, it's the, it's the collecting all the different pieces. So today with Domo, I think we have something like 35 different data sources. Um, from that, a hundred and, you know, 60 plus different data sets, right, that we're then kinda streaming together. Um, that was not possible (laughs) at any amount of scale, like, before Domo, right? Um, but then more importantly is, yes, it takes a little bit of work to get the initial data online and, you know, kind of do that, but we only have to do that work then once. And now we can then, you know, it's automated after that. The data runs every day. The models are updating, right? And so it, it really took ... You know, while it takes, always takes effort to do something right the first time, with Domo, we were able to do it (laughs) right once and then hit repeat, repeat, repeat, auto load, you know, schedule, and not have to re- go back to, I'm gonna call it, those lower value tasks. Like, you, you've gotta have 'em, but, um, you know, it, it doesn't add value kind of once you get past the initial setup piece. So- You think of that idea, Daniel, that we talked about, the going from the menial to the meaningful. Mm-hmm. Yeah. That's what you've been able to do. You've been able to take something that, is it important to be able to get Tammy the, the information she needs? For sure. However, if you had to do that- Yeah. ... each and every time, which you'd have to do from a spreadsheet perspective-... like- Yeah. ... you go to mean, you, you go to, you know, it's not meaningful work anymore. Yeah. So that's awesome. Yeah. 'Kay, poll question everybody. Get ready. Jump into the polls tab for those who are on here. I wanna hear. Tammy and I are ... we're, we're really intrigued at this point. From your perspective, we're watching you, we're watching you, what do CMOs care about most when it comes to marketing? What do CMOs care about most when it comes to marketing? I'm seeing some revenue impact and marketing IO and at- ROI and attribution. I, whoever the, whoever the people with revenue impact, I don't wanna tell you that's the right answer, but that's probably the right answer, so, uh, (laughs) good work. Uh, brand awareness, yes, massive fan. We were having a conversation with my team this morning about brand awareness. It's really important, but it's a mean to an end. If you are not growing the business, retaining customers, if lifetime value isn't increasing, we're not doing our job. So really, really intriguing. Okay, Tammy, what did I get wrong there? Did I say anything I wasn't supposed to? No, I, I love that. I, I completely agree with you. (laughs) Gravity impact. I love it. Yeah, everybody's saying revenue impact. I love it. Okay, Daniel, next up. You built the model that ties, and any time you, you wanna show stuff don't, don't be scared. You built the model- Okay. (laughs) ... that ties marketing investments to those sales outcomes. Yeah. So what signals or data points were most critical to making that connection accurate and trusted? Well, let me, let me start by let, let, let me kind of get, give the audience a little bit of a journey, right? Like, I, I think, I think this will kind of frame it up, uh, hopefully nicely. So, um, obviously, right, to get insights, right, you gotta get access to the data. We've been, been kind of talking about that. Um, but I'll tell you something that I do love about Domo, right? I mean, like, most BI tools or, you know, any platforms you've got, you know, you gotta get connections to the data. Domo does that in spades, right? Not only can you connect to your data in, you know, a database, but a lot of point solutions. So, uh, credit to you guys for investing (laughs) in the, uh, the deal. Let me, let me pull it up here. I'll, I'll show you kind of what I'm talking about. Ooh, live demo everybody. Get ready. I know, I know. Get ready. Look out. We'll pray to the demo gods it works. Okay, so within Domo, right, you can connect to your data from all kinds of different sources. What I love about this and, you know, you can ... (laughs) There's a lot of tools, frankly, Marc, that, you know, you can connect to data with, but you guys honestly make it so easy of, you know, if I want to connect to a new platform, you know, Tammy's team just the other day came to us like, "Hey, we're thinking about running ads here. Do you have it," right? And the connectors you guys have built out, um, you know, make that super easy to get the data in so that the big lift of even just getting the data out, uh, I don't know for any of those in the audience that have spent time digging through API documentation. It's not a, we'll call it, uh (laughs), a very productive use of your time or, you know, I, I de- I definitely don't enjoy it, right? But you got all the connectors in here that we can connect to something, enter in your credentials, enter in your API tokens, and, you know, within, you know, moments or, you know, minutes you're getting data versus, you know, days or weeks or months. Obviously, your data might live in a database, right? You know, of course. Um, so you can connect to that. Whether it's on prem or, you know, in the cloud, uh, you know, Domo offers those connectors to, you know, any database you can think about. But this is actually probably something, I didn't think about at first whenever we kind of delved in, but the write-back connectors, which for us unlocked, hey, you know, (laughs) we used to get all these ... Yeah, we got all the good data here in the BI tool, but how do you get it out to make it more meaningful, right? So, you know, for example, you know, we use HubSpot, right? Like, we can write the data and insights we get in Domo right back into HubSpot. Of course we can, you know, send it back to Snowflake or, you know, whatever database tool that you're using, um, but that's really unlocked a new value to where now Domo is, you know, more of a pass through that adds value without us having to then, you know, kind of like lock it up. Like, oh, this stuff is so great, like, how do I get it here, right? 'Cause back to automation and reducing manual, right? If I have to, like, download a spreadsheet and give it to Tammy and she, you know, Tammy's team and they upload it into HubSpot, like, but you guys can do that even with the write-back connector, so um, that's been something I think super transformational on our journey is getting the data connected, automating it. Um, I'm not ashamed to say I spend much less time in API documentation than I used to, um, and here, Marc, I, I'll give you a, a little plug for the audience. I don't, I don't know if I'm supposed to talk about this, right? But Domo, being the AI forward thinking, uh, company they are, they're already in beta for a API connector powered by AI, right? So you would point it at the API documentation. Let's just say it's, Domo has a lot of connectors, but they don't have it for this one. You point it at the API documentation and AI kind of helps create that connector for you. So now, again, freeing your data, like, Marc, that's, that's so cool. Like, you know, thank you guys for investing in that area so we don't have to, uh, but we'll definitely take benefit, uh, from it whenever you get there, so. I love that. That's awesome to hear. So from an analytics perspective, Daniel, um, how, how do you or Tammy's team go about identifying those underperforming channels and vendors so that you can then decide where to reallocate spend? Yeah, I mean, you know, I think a, a big portion of that, um, is like I said, trying to make sure we're connecting the dots. We, we kind of standardize the data so, um, you know, obviously kind of like our, the next stage in the journey of data, you know, with Domo, right, is like transforming and cleaning that data up, um, and that's where, you know, honestly it's probably my favorite part of Domo, but Domo gives you the ability kind of, I would call it with techni- you know, more advanced technical capabilities as well as less to really, um, model that data and get it in a useful state 'cause, you know, raw data, as we all know, is generally not very friendly for doing that, um. Do you mind if I, I show the audience that? Do it.All right. So I'll jump back in, uh, Domo here. So within the, um, platform, you know, they've got the transformations and you can transform it a few different ways, um, but my favorite part is Magic ETL. Uh, and I- I- I'll give a little plug, um, whenever I was at the- the Domo conference, uh, I think when the product manner- manager for Magic ETL, Andrea, came on the stage, um, she probably had one of the biggest applauses because while at the end of the result, everyone is talking about like the insights you pull from the data, this is really where the magic happens that kind of cleans that up. And so it might look a little overwhelming at first, but, um, you know, it's a pretty simple interface that also is very powerful. So whether you've got a team that's, you know, really, you know, deep into, you know, SQL and knows a lot of that, or a team that's a little more basic, um, but has really good business context and strategy, um, you know, they can kind of use this. Plus Domo plugs in all the, you know, advanced, you know, Python scripting or, you know, auto ML to, you know, understand and get more insights out of your data, even AI, right? Like, how do we extract from our data, you know, more meaningful, um, you know, decision points. That's where, you know, we really love this part of it. And for every analyst I know, um, you know, this is- this is definitely their favorite part of it. Now to be fair, it's less of what Tammy sees, right? But it's how we get there and it's how we unlock that value, um, to be able to, and I'll- I'll just kind of throw this out there for those of you that are, you know, thinking about staffing your team. I was, you know, talking, um, a couple of months back at the Forrester conference with another, you know, business leader there, and they were talking about scaling their, you know, data team. And I'm like, "Okay, well, like, what do you think?" Like, they were just kind of starting out, I was like, "What do you think it's gonna take to, like, get your team up and running and, you know, make an impact in your business?" And he was like, you know, rattled off, you know, like probably a half dozen different tools that he thought he would need and an equal number of FTEs. And I don't- I don't know, it might have been like maybe a slight grin that came on my face or something, but he was like, "Well, like, what- what do you- what- what did you do? Like, what- what would you do at my stage?" And I'm like, "You know, we're- when we were where you were, we had two people at Domo," right? Which I think kind of goes back to the power of like when you invest in the right tools, then now you can kind of unlock, you know, another level of productivity. So to be fair, we're in a, you know, decently sized company. We have 4,000, you know, some odd people, odd, you know, team members across the globe. We have a team of five. Now, do I answer every, you know, Tammy question as much as I would want to and as much as... Probably not, right? But like a team of five supporting 4,000, like, that's not possible with the right tools. Um, not to mention, you know, back to my, you know, conversation, I'm like, it's way more cost-efficient than if you go out and hire all these advanced skill people. And I've even known that, you know, recently in my own recruiting, if I make requirements that you've got to be- have expert SQL knowledge and you've got to have like deep database, like, it- I can find people that match that, they're just a lot more expensive. And so really in our recruiting efforts even, we- we focus on like, how do we bring people in that can understand the business context and really help us unlock value out of our data? And I- I can be more focused on that piece of it than like the technical skills, because again, Domo can kind of scale with that individual skill set. So that's- that's something we've really liked about our experience with Domo. I love that. Tammy, I'm sure is thinking the same thing. Behind every CMO is a- a team of people that are deep in data helping us understand how do we pull the right levers to be able to make a big impact. Tammy, did I- did I speak for you correctly? Exactly. Exactly. I started thinking of what- what our business would be like, Daniel, without- without the data. And I've been at other places where I Mm-hmm. ... access to the data to be able to make these decisions. And I honestly don't know how I did it. Like now- Mm-hmm. ... I'm at a point where I have- I have so much data and I know- I know the impact of things so early on that is- is just so powerful, so powerful. Okay, Daniel, I know that I'm talking too much. I apologize. Mm-hmm. Uh, let's talk a little bit about the consumption model. So some people know, uh, we went on this journey to- to kind of switch our pricing model a little bit. Uh, the consumption model now has 75+% of our ARR. Uh, the vast majority of our customers are now on consumption. You've adopted that, uh- Yeah. ... to scale your overall analytics success. What did that change for you, you know, compared to the traditional seat-based licings you were on be- licensing you were on before? Yeah, you know, and I- I know that that, you know, even strategically for your, you know, org, like that was a pivot of right, like, "Hey, how- how do we do this," right? And, you know, I'll tell you kind of firsthand, you know, from the customer standpoint, right? Like, we were on seat-based, and the good news is like the value was there, right? Like, we were unlocking insights and the business was going, "Hey, like, can- can I see that? Can I get that?" And- and it was like, we were like downloading PDFs of dashboards. So we were like, "Wait a minute, wait," like going backwards, right? Like, we're going back to the manual world because like, you know, we got this. And then, you know, you guys kind of launched the capacity and so it's like our team looked at it, right? And we're like, "Okay, like, what does this mean?" But, you know, really to, you know, power do- insights in your business, like you want to... To be fair, Tammy is always going to get the data that Tammy needs to kind of do that. But Tammy has a lot of people under her, right? That are making actually, you know, real time decisions in market that now we can empower with those same insights, right? They can go look at the same dashboards, they can like be digging in ad copy somewhere and they're like, "Wait a minute, like I think I saw something. Like how do I connect those dots?" Right? And I think that's where the power of the consumption model really helped value unlock for us. We went from, you know, (laughs) we'll call it being very seat constrained at 50 to now we're over 500, right? And that's 500 more people that don't have to fly blind, right? But that's, you know, that's part of it. The other thing that I- I love about the, you know, the switch, right? Is, um, to be fair, I didn't like it before as much Mark of- of like the gating issue, right? Like, you know, DomoPalooza, you guys launch something new and cool and I'm like, "I want to try that."... they're like, "Oh, well, you gotta, you gotta pay f- for this or that." And I, I get it. That was the model, right? But it's like, but I'm like, "I don't, I don't know if it's gonna add value yet, but I, you know, like, I wanna explore it." And now, you know, we can go in there, you'll, you get to try out all these new features. So something rolls out, I'm like, "Guys, like, jump in there, see if we can figure out..." The cool part, though, is, like, when it unlocks value for us and we're like, "Yes, that worked. That's unlocking value," then Domo gets paid. So, like, I don't mind that, right? Like, you just unlocked value for me, so now we're, we're kinda sharing in that experience together. So I think that's been something with the, you know, consumption model that's really helped us, you know, like I said, empower more decision-makers. I love that. I love the idea that, uh, you know, and, and I'm not surprised by any of that. Okay, you'd hear really cool stuff at Domo+ and you're like, "Yes, I wanna try it." (laughs) Sorry, you don't have access to it. You got it on consumption, now there's no issue of only 50 people can get in. Yeah. No, we've increased 10X where we were. And if I think that AI is gonna be valuable to me, if I think that changes to workflows, if I think that new things with new clouds, whether Snowflake, Databricks, or whatever, like, it's all there. You have access to any and all of it. So we talked a little bit about it, this idea of how has this accelerated adoption across your team. Well, it's 10X the amount of people- Mm-hmm. ... that are getting value from it. Um, what have you seen in terms of kinda collaboration, cultural shift as more people get access to the data and the ability to go and make decisions with the data? Yeah. W- let me, let me, let me show you kind of... This is my, this is my last demo and then I'll (laughs) th- then, then I'll stop here, right? But, but I'll show you this, right? 'Cause we, we actually had to rethink our strategy of how we empower people with data across that. So, um, whenever, you know, whenever we start getting, you know, hundreds and hundreds of people in here, right? Like, now you're like, wait a minute, like, I've gotta organize this in a way that's simplistic for people to be able to get to the insights and do that. So we kind of redesigned, I'm gonna call it our navigation experience, um, to make it a little more graphical, right? So you can, you know... We also controlled, and so that's the other thing I like with Domo. We get the ability to control the user experience. So, like, when you log into Domo, everyone hits here. I know where you start. Um, and then, you know, we provide these little click icons to do it, which is really just a dashboard, but again, a dashboard that we've kinda featured up. Um, I will say too, though, uh, we're also, uh, (laughs) using the new Domo, uh, you know, navigation. And honestly, that's, that's been, uh, amazing too. You know, you can do the same thing in the navigation, right? So I mentioned we support a lot of stakeholders. So yes, we support marketing, uh, but we support sales and product. Um, but this just kinda helps keep our data organized so that, you know, a marketing user can, you know, click through, you know, find the dashboard that they're wanting to look at. And I'll jump over here for a second on, you know, some dashboards, right? I mean, you know, okay, this is one of many, right? But this is, like, a dashboard that's giving, you know, our stakeholders high-level insights on, you know, how their business is performing, how are we doing on metrics. Um, but, and I'll, I'll jump here kind of into the, you know, to the editor, right? There's, you know, again, back to investments, uh, that you guys have already made. There's hundreds and hundreds of different chart types, um, to, you know, help you frame and tell the story with, you know, whatever data that you're using. Mm-hmm. Um, so I think that helps a lot with, you know, getting your audience, like, how do you make the insights pop so that that way you can spend less time... Uh, you know, I always remember the design principle, right? Like, you want, you want everything that's not, you know, driving value to kind of, like, fall away. And I think with, you know, again, the investments you guys have made in the customization, like, that, that gives us the ability to do that. You, you hit on, you know, AI for... (laughs) you know, and we've talked about AI kinda throughout this dialogue. I wi- I will say that, you know, for Thrive, right? Like, we're, you know, making investments and we're looking at it, but from my seat, you know, I'm saying like, how do we empower our insights with AI, you know, partnering obviously with Domo. Um, to be fair, I'm gonna let you guys fight the AI talent wars and spend the big bucks, right? But what I've seen you do, whether it was connectors or Magic ETL or, you know, the dashboard experience, what I really appreciate is you guys have i- in a way made it reachable, you know, achievable, you know, simplistic, right? And so, you know, in that way, we're gonna unlock value leveraging Domo and AI inside of Domo. And frankly, we didn't have to invest all the same energy (laughs) in hiring the resources and finding the talents 'cause I think that's what you guys do really well, is you almost kinda live, I think, a little bit... I think it's scary, Mark, but in, in an analyst brain, even the new nav I called out, I will, I will be fair, I was not a, like, "I want new nav" right away 'cause I'm like, that is like changing, shifting. We eventually said, "Okay, we're gonna create a little small beta group and we're gonna do that." Mm-hmm. And I will truthfully say within, like, a week or so, I'm like, "Oh my gosh." Like, Mark somehow crawled inside my head and, like, figured out- (laughs) ... like, okay, like, product team do this, like, move it here. And so that's what I, I think has been, you know, again, just back to, like, how do you get people to collaborate and use? Like, all the, all the noise has to kinda get stripped away and you have to be able to bring those insights forward. Uh, and I think Domo, whether, you know, like I said, you know, just logging in, looking at a chart, right? You can do that, right? And so that's... It's made something that is definitely complex more simple. And when it's more simple, people get the insight from it and can make a decision off of it, so. I love that. So I'm gonna keep peppering questions at, at, at Daniel and Tammy, but anyone who has questions, throw them in, throw them in the chat for me and I will, I'll bring 'em up. Uh, we may have a few more minutes at the very end to be able to ask some, but throw anything you have in the, in the chat if there's anything you want me to ask. Okay, Daniel, governance, one of the biggest challenges- (laughs) Yeah. ... for any person working in the analytics space. So you've 10X'd the amount of users who are engaging with data now. Amazing. Yeah. How do you balance accessibility now with governance and data quality? Yeah. Um, let's, let's kinda take, you know, that user experience journey, you know-... in that one of the things that we learned is, (laughs) instead of adding people individually to dashboards, right? Like Domo offers a group, you know, kind of feature, right? Where you can, I can group all of Tammy's org within a particular, you know, group. And then, you know, I can add that group to a dashboard or a dataset or whatever. So groups alone, I mean, it's, it seems very simplistic, but that's a very simple way to go. Like, this group has access to these and this group, you know, has access to that. A- and you can kind of s- keep that separate. Obviously from, like a PII and, you know, the other additional requirements to be, you know, GDR, GDPR compliant, you know, Domo has, I'm gonna call it some more backend of like, oh, like on this dataset, like, you know, you can't actually see these particular fields if you're within, you know, these groups. But again, it kind of manages within that group experience. So that's been really helpful. It's also been super helpful, um, that the groups can be dynamic too, right? So, you know, Tammy as she often does, like she might be adding new resources to her team or things are changing around, like, well as soon as you hit Domo and your role or your team, you know, falls within this, you get automatically added to a group, which means you automatically get those governance controls applied. And so, um, I didn't call it out, uh, necessarily, but at the bottom of that, you know, little homepage dashboard, right? It kind of reads out a line of like, you can see some of these icons, but you might not get access to everything. And like governance rules apply, right? And it's like, okay, obviously it was, it was, it was our legal footnote, right? But it was like, it's easy for us to manage that through the, you know, Domo interface. And so I thankfully I don't maybe spend as much time thinking about governance once we've kind of set the framework in place and then Domo kind of takes care of it in the background for us. Um, so that's, that's one way that we kind of help, you know, ensure people A, have access, but then they have the right access. I love that. So Daniel, one of the Domo community legends? Yes, he is Elliot Leonard, how are you? Welcome. Thanks for joining me. Yes. Uh, one of the greatest analysts out there, he actually has a question that may be my next question, so I'm gonna give credit to Elliot for it. Um, what's your vision for data and analytics for Thrive in the next 12 months? What are you most excited about? We, we did a pretty big pivot, um, last, like the last 12 months in shifting, I'm gonna call it like our, our data architecture strategy so that, you know, not uncommon, right? But, you know, you could connect to data, but you've got like all the, the raw different data sources and if each analyst is going to the raw data and pulling out their own insights, right? Like then all of a sudden you get version control and Tammy's like, "Wait a minute, why do the numbers over here not match over here?" Um, and so we've kind of addressed that this past year. Like we really got a, a better, you know, not really governance, right? But a better organization kind of within our teams to go like, okay, this is the source of truth. Like if there's two different numbers, we can easily explain it from, you know, a filter here or there. I think what I'm most looking forward to in the, you know, kind of year ahead is honestly where can I automate more of the processes that my team do to continually free up that space? So, um, for example, like we're right now kind of in the development stages of an AI agent in Domo to help us like, clean up the data and make it, you know, more analytics ready. But again, same thing we'll spend, we'll say, you know, a bunch of work right here to like, get this up and running and then it's just gonna run and keep the data clean. You know, as Tammy well knows, like we've got, you know, duplications in systems and we've got like, you know, different things. So it's like there, there's a bunch of noise that, you know, credit to what we're doing today and you know, again, Domo made that a little bit easier. I think AI agents are gonna make it even easier. And so that's where I'm, I don't know, I could see like 15, 20, I don't know, 100 agents kind of like spinning up in the next year of like fix these problems for us so we don't have to think about it again. And then we don't have to think about it again, right? So I think that's what I'm most, most hopeful for. And, you know, with where the tools are and obviously the platform, um, you know, we can, we can do that, right? Like, you know, we're, we're, we're ready for that stage. So that's what I'm, I've gotten my, my most focused on in the, the year ahead. I love that Daniel, and I love the fact that you're building the agents within Domo to be able to do that work for you. Uh- Again, you hand, you hand served it to me, right? So wh- why not, right? You made it easy. (laughs) I like that. I like that answer Daniel. I like you. I think we should keep you around. (laughs) Uh, Tammy. Okay. Your SaaS platform at Thrive is built to help, I mean, a lot of small businesses run smarter. So when we look at these insights that, you know, have, how do those insights that you're building and that Daniel's helping you build internally translate into outcomes for your customers? Well, that's an interesting question. Well, I, I'll give you one example that comes to mind. We look a lot at NPS scores, and as Daniel alluded to, right? That's not just a marketing function or just a customer support function or just an onboarding function, right? On and on and on. Or a product, you know, uh, function. It, it's sort of taking the data across that whole customer life cycle and being able to understand how can we provide the best, you know, experience for our customers and make sure we have really, you know, solid and are always improving our NPS scores so that we, you know, build that raving fans, right? That the, uh, the CMO always wants to, uh, to build. Uh, and so I would say that's probably one of the best examples of how Domo has really helped us to support, you know, the, the right, you know, that customer feedback across the life cycle and be able to make decisions about... 'cause you're constantly making trade-off decisions, right? About, you know, should we invest in A, B, or C? And, you know, and constantly trying to optimize across the business. And so, uh, Domo has really helped us and the dashboards that Daniel's created and the work he's done to support, you know, a better customer experience. I love that. Okay, one more question, Daniel. I'm gonna start with you and then I'm gonna give Tammy the, the last word. And it's the same question though. So Daniel, as someone who has run analytics and, and business insights programs now for years, if you have to share one piece of advice with another person in your shoes who feels stuck in what we might call checkers mode.... uh- (laughs) Yeah. ... what, what would it be? You know, a- again, if I, if I go back to that, that conversation that I was having, you know, with that other business leader at Forrester, right? Like, to me, getting the right, the right tools in place, um, can really unlock, you know, another level of value. And so, um, I think you have to invest the resources and that... To, to be fair, Mark, Domo is not the low-cost leader for analytics, right? Like, there are other cheaper platforms out there. But frankly, we've tried some of them, and we get cheaper results, right? And so, like, I think that that's, that's where I, um... I think you've gotta make the investment in the right tools. Uh, fine, if you're, you know, a company size like the customers we serve of two, right? Maybe, maybe that you're not ready for that, like those simple tools can work. But as, as your, your organization matures, you know, to me, the, the right tool investment can make, make a big difference. Um, and we already talked about it earlier today too, um, it also goes to scale. Like, how can I, you know, 10X and, you know, 15X and 100X, you know, my output. That's, you know, I kinda reference it when we were talking about the AI stuff. You know, that's really what AI is for all of us, right? Like, it's not something to be afraid of, of like, "Oh, it's gonna take my job." It's like, well, frankly, there's more work that Tami would want me to do that I just don't have time for, and no organization is ever gonna give you an unlimited check to just go do whatever, right? Like, so, like, AI's really gonna supercharge our ability to do that. Um, again, I, I mentioned it, but I (laughs) I was not kidding. I'm gonna let Mark pay for (laughs), you know, some of that AI resource so I don't have to, right? Now, the good news for Mark is you get to duplicate that across a lot of different customers, but I'm, I'm gonna leverage that, right? But again, you guys are forward-thinking and, like, how do we shake the space up? And that's where, for us, the, you know, strategic investment in Domo is really, um, I think positioning us to meet the market as it rises and to, you know, meet the new challenges as they come, to leverage the new technologies. Um, but you don't have to do it all yourself either, and I think that's... You know, we see that, you know, especially right now with a lot of AI headlines, like, "Ninety-five percent of AI projects fail," but, you know, 100% of, you know, employees and businesses are using AI every day. You know, that's- Yeah. ... that's just kind of where, where I see it, so. I love that. Daniel, what an absolute rockstar. Yes, I said it. I know we're not supposed to use the word rockstar around anal-... I don't care. He- (laughs) ... is an analytics rockstar. Tami- (laughs) ... one piece of advice that you would share with other CMOs who feel stuck in this, in this checkers-like mode, what would it be? Well, I, I think th- just recognizing the power of understanding the data and analytics across business, right? Uh, you know, I, I love that Domo and, and the work that Daniel's doing gives me, you know, command of the marketing practice, but I think even more powerful is being able to understand across the business, you know, where, where we should be making recommendations in order to drive more revenue, in order to have a more efficient, you know, go-to-market and a more, you know, efficient, uh, strategy and the execution against that strategy, you know, all in service of revenue. And, and you really... In order to do that, you really need to understand and have exposed to you that data across every area of the business. I love that. Tami, Daniel, thank you so much for taking time with us today. Thank you for being an amazing customer. Uh, you have my number and my info. If you- (laughs). ... ever need anything, don't hesitate to reach out. Thanks, everybody, for joining us. We've had a really great group that's been here. Uh, if we can do anything for you at any point, don't hesitate to reach out. Have a great day. Thanks.